2019 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1

2019 Chevrolet Camaro videos

Muscle Car Debrief: Chevy Camaro ZL1 vs. Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 vs. Dodge Challenger Hellcat Redeye

[ENGINES ROARING] - Hi. Welcome to this totally natural muscle car education experience because we know nothing about cars. Isn't that right, Alana. - I have all these books, and I've memorized them. - Memorized them? Good, because I need to work on my homework. Welcome to our muscle car drag race comparison roundup video where Kurt, Alana, and myself are going to talk about our favorite moments from this experience-- let's call it that-- answer some of the most common questions we saw, and talk about things that didn't make the final edit. Just go into more detail on nuance, than we were able to in the video. - Let's start with the first, most prominent question that we got. Why are we so bad at driving, Kurt? - I'm an auto-journalist, and auto-journalists can't drive. ALANA: I'm 47 squirrels in a t-shirt. And squirrels can't drive. HOST: I use a revolving door of stunt doubles, and they're all pretty bad. - And poorly payed. - Yeah. - Go! - Let's talk about the cars that we brought. And to back it up, this whole thing started when Ford got ready to unveil the GT 500 and let us drive it. And we do a GT 500, you do a comparison. And that's what we did. - Yeah. If you bring a Ford, you have to bring a Chevy. So if you bring a Mustang, you have to bring a Camaro. And if the Mustang has a wing on it, the Camaro needs to have a wing on it. - But the challenge is a little tricky too because it's kind of a different care, almost. - Well, certainly in the Drag Race video, Dodge has made more drag race specific cars, the Demon. But the rule for this video was these had to be the top of the line offering that you could currently purchase in a dealership and a Demon you can only get as a used car currently, so. - Exactly. We were looking for the highest performing ones that you could get new. And that's why we didn't get the standard ZL1, which actually might have fared better in many ways, but it-- - It's a little more comfortable. - It also would have been like another 10 grand or 15 grand less expensive, which even makes the playing field that we tried to level out as much as possible even more difficult to do. And also, you get the 1LE. It's sexier, right? But also let's talk about how it ties to our personal cars. Kurt, what do you drive? - I have a 1966 Mustang coupe. Not a fast back there, but I'm building it to be a replica of FIA group 2 car, which they raced. But a little known fact is that Carroll Shelby actually built 16 of the cars for Ford to race in the early Trans Am series, and FIA Group 2. So this has Shelby badge on it, so the same thing, right? - It's got stripes too, right? - I hate stripes. - Now, Ilana, you have a lot of cars. We're gonna let you-- only going to let you talk about one. - Well, I mean the only one that applies to this is the 1970s Dodge Challenger. I bought it from the original owner. I used it as a daily driver with a 440 for about 10 years, and then I got all clever and I built a 505 cubic inch stroker motor. Now it gets 8 miles per gallon and I barely ever drive it. - And I've got a 1972 Chevy C-10. Some guy found it on a farm, painted it, fixed the rust, shortened the bed. It's got a 350 and a four speed on the floor, and it's nowhere near as well put together as either of your guy's cars, but it sure is loud. But slow, and kind of hairy about 40 miles an hour. - I hate that your truck is louder than my car and I have side pipes. - Tilt them downwards and they just reverberate off the ground, and your neighbors and wife will hate you. - OK. - I talk from experience. - I mean, really, don't we all just want more people to hate us? - That's why we did this comparison. - Let's talk about the first video we put up, the drag race, which was great fun. - Can we do nothing but drag race videos from now on? Like, Edmunds! We do nothing but drag race videos. HOST: You joke. But we'll talk about that later. KURT: Good. HOST: Well, you know, you get three super powerful muscle cars next each other, even though ones kind of built for road racing. You do the drag race. And that's what we did. We had some trouble getting it all to work right, because it was 40 degrees out, and all the cars had trouble hooking up. Right? But the funny thing is, the final placement actually matched what we got at the test track. We tested all these cars at our test track at sea level, essentially. On a warmer day, we actually had to correct our acceleration. Kurt, you drove a lot of the vehicles. You did the testing in it. Tell us about it. - Yeah. All three of the cars performed in a very similar manner, as we experienced. And they all behaved in a very similar manner as well, where the Shelby couldn't really care less if it was a launch control or just in sport, or track mode. It manages wheel spin well, and the motor is just ferocious. Like over 5,000 RPMs, and it just pulls, and pulls, and pulls. It goes all the way to 2,500, bangs off a shift, that's it. Similarly, the Camaro is fairly easy to launch. It's almost like if you can imagine Usain Bolt tripping, and there's the pause where the Camaro kind of processes wheel-spin-- - What just happened? - And, then it just explodes. And it just took off, and I think I used a lot of profanity when I did the passes. But also like, it just shifts really quickly. It's easy to control the car. And then there was the Redeye, which has launch control, but the launch control is engineered I think for a prepped surface and lower pressures and we run-- we run with what the car says the tire pressures should be. We don't run on a prepared surface, and the Redeye just can't really handle that. And the traction control as you found out, it fights it for the longest time, and then it just kind of goes, fine. And then you just light 'em up. - And the Hellcat, the launch technique is pretty different, right? - Yeah, it is. Because first and second are so short in that car, and it is basically engineered to run on a prep surface. I found that using second gear and not really even brake torquing the car at all, just rolling in to the throttle to you think it can handle the power, and then just flooring it. So it's a very sensitive procedure to make sure that the car does not just incinerate through the top [INAUDIBLE]. [LAUGHTER] - And the Camaro, too. It has the problem of being a car that's built for road racing, so it's got extremely firmer suspension. So it doesn't get the weight transfer that it needs to get that additional rear grid, and then take off. That's why it was having such a difficult time, but hey, you can't fault a road race car for not being good at drag racing, unless it's a Camaro. And Ilana, you were having frustration. You were frustrated at the launch control during the drag race as well. - I hate launch control. Stupid. - Well, like Kurt said, you know, it would hold it, and then it would just dump it. And then I would spin and watch him go by, watch you go by, very frustrating. - On a prep surface you'd have a better time for sure, but again, we have to reiterate that the times that you saw at the end of the drag race video are what we got from our test track on at sea level in pretty ideal weather conditions. If you're on a prep surface, yeah, the numbers would probably be better. They would definitely be better, but the placement is roughly the same. And it was impressive that even though we were drag racing them in cold weather, we matched the placement that we got at the test track. That was-- that was interesting. - Yeah. And if you were racing, if you were truly drag racing these cars, the rules are totally different. There's a whole lot more about reaction time, and so, yes, I could absolutely beat Kurt in the Mustang with the challenger if I was just a better driver on a drag strip with the lights and all of that. But we didn't have those rules. We were following rules that we had set. HOST: Also, the Challenger doesn't have that delay with the launch control. KURT: Yeah, and I will completely admit, yes I got treed. I got a whole-shotted. However you want to explain it. It was just me getting used to waiting, and the wait time seemed slightly inconsistent. But I-- yes. - You still won. - Yeah. - Moving on to the comparison test, which we should say is a separate video. We've done a drag race video, the comparison video, and also this round table discussion video. But now we're gonna talk about the comparison, which was a ton of fun. ALANA: I wish we were doing right now. It was pretty much the best day ever. - It was great. And I'm glad that we started with the burnout super test because that's an old Edmunds' video idea that we used to do a long time ago, and I'm going to try to bring it back. So if you enjoyed that, let us know, because it was really silly. And really, really fun. ALANA: We are willing to do it again. KURT: Burnouts for science. For you. HOST: But there were some technical challenges with the burnout, surprisingly. You'd figure if you had a, you know, average horsepower on 730 and a rear-wheel drive car, you could do Smokey's all day, but apparently you can't. - Why did you guys look at me? - Because the Mustang lost. - That's not my fault. - It's just, it's not-- it's not made for that. KURT: It has a higher purpose. HOST: It has a higher purpose. It's a Mustang, there's no higher purpose. Well, then the challenge is, so OK, if you're going to do a rolling burnout, right, you're going to sit two feet in, brake on, gas on, and then you're going to come off the brake pedal and pump on the gas pedal a little bit just to just do a smoky as long as you want. You're going to control the front wheels and spin the rears. Right? Unfortunately with these cars, you could do that until you had no tire left, so we had to limit it, somehow. And that's why saying, no brakes. The surprising thing was the Mustang didn't really do a big smoky to start out with-- - Right. - Neither did the Camaro. And then the Challenger-- - If there are any SRT engineers watching this right now, good job gang. You know what we want. - I just remember looking over at the cloud of smoke and just giggling. Because it was-- it was insane. It wasn't just the length. It was like, how dark the tire marks were. It was great. It was-- it was fantastic. - Yeah, I was trying to count the shifts as the car accelerated. I think you wind up in fourth gear and the car is just like, sure. OK. You want more? I got more. This is great. - We can do this all day. - This is great. - Now, line-lock. Most of these cars have line-lock, but we didn't use it. And there's a good reason for that. Philosophically, of course, if you just want to do a burnout to impress your friends, the longer it takes you to actually do the burnout from the time that you've decided to do the burnout, the worse off you are. You can't just like look out the window, your friends-- hey, hold on a sec while I figure out the computers and electronics and stuff. I firmly believe, the further away we get from clutch in, full throttle, clutch out, the further away we get from God. - Right. Anyone who disagrees with you is wrong. - So like the Mustang can do a big Smokey in line-lock, but it's a kind of a pain in the butt to get there. - Yeah, it's just not-- like you said, it's not a fluid movement of hey y'all, watch-- this. You can't just do that. It takes time, and then no one cares anymore. You look like an idiot, so, yeah. - Yeah. You've lost the cars and coffee, you know, Instagram video timeline. You can't fit it in there by the time it takes you to do that. - Well, a burnout should never be something you think about doing, is the thing. It should just happen. - There's no logic to it. Just enjoy it. That was great. That was a lot of fun. - The utility test, too, surprisingly insightful and useful. KURT: Right? ALANA: I laughed really hard the whole time too, so that was pretty fun as well. HOST: It was nice. We had the spare tires lying around, so we decided like, yeah, we can use that to see how big and useful each interior is. But it's actually helpful for these cars, right? ALANA: Well the original idea came because, I mean, I used to go drag racing all the time, and I would take my extra tires, my drag-racing cars, throw them in the car, one in the trunk, one in the backseat, and drive to the track and change them, and then head home. So I mean, it is a real thing, I assume other people did it too. HOST: Yeah. I mean after this video went live, a guy reached out to me-- I think it was on Reddit, or something. He said, like hey, I drag race my Corvette. I put a spare tire in the hatch, I put a spare tire on the front passenger seat, and I don't run skinnies because I have nowhere to put them. So this is actually a hugely valuable thing for these kind of cars. And then people laugh that we give a two-seat Mustang the win for utility. To them I say, have you ever sat in the backseat of a Mustang? KURT: Yeah, or the backseat of a Camaro. - I mean, generally, you pretend those seats don't exist. The Challenger has usable back seats. For people, but not for tires. - I mean, you can fit a little bit of tire. - Now, sound. Muscle car has gotta sound cool. Pony car has got to sound cool. Sports cars should sound cool. Unfortunately, much like burnouts, you need to be able to just show off to your buddies when you're parked. And you can't with the Challenger and the Camaro. - Yeah. I mean, I guess logically I understand why the cars are protecting us from our own stupidity. But I do not want to be protected from my own stupidity. I embrace it. And I want to make loud noises. - What do you would want out of me, like a sad trombone or something? Like-- Mustang engineers might not have gotten the out burnout part of their engineering correct-- I don't even care that much about that-- but they certainly let you rev the piss out of it. And that's what it's all about. HOST: And, it's great. Like the Mustang gets it. You're driving along, you pull both paddles in, you get neutral, and you can just rev the hell out of that thing. It's literally there to impress kids on the school bus. Like when I was driving up to the shoot, I was on the freeway. I was 15, and there's a guy in Hyundai. He was like recording video, giving me the thumbs up. Yeah. Neutral, raa, raa, raa, raa. It was-- everybody was happy. It was a great time for everybody on that freeway. I'm going to believe. But the guy in the Hyundai was real happy about that. At least they sound good while flying by. - Yeah they all sound good under full throttle. - Yeah. But when you're driving, like when we did our drive-ability mountain road comfort test, that's when we really started to see how specific some of these cars were with their intentions, right? Yeah. The Camaro was terrible. ALANA: That's spoken like a man whose tailbone still hurts. - The Camaro is super road racing build has got really, really, really, really firm suspension. And it's super uncomfortable on real roads. Like, driving back in to La, you know, the front tires would hit a bump, and the rear tires feel like they would go off a shelf. And it was like, really? What happened? What's wrong? It's like-- oh, that's just how firm it is. Camaro was bad, but the challenger and the Mustang were really good. - That was one of the things that just blew me away on the Shelby, was just the breadth of capability. If you wanted to drive to track two hours away, Shelby wouldn't beat you up on the way there. Then you could put it in track mode, have a lot of fun, and head home. And you're not tired and exhausted. I drove that Camaro once, and that is the first car I've driven that makes the case for not buying that car, and buying three other vehicles instead. A truck, a trailer, and an actual race car. But going back to the Shelby, the seats are great. I mean they're not wide-boy seats like the Redeye has in them. But the Recaros are still fairly comfortable. They bolster so you can get past them, and they hold on to you and hug you and breathe OK. ALANA: Aww. Who doesn't want a hug. I mean, I'm assuming that wide-boy comment was to the car and not to me, but even if it wasn't-- yeah, the Challenger, right? Wide seats, wide car. A lot of criticism for how big it is, but that bigness is what makes it so comfortable. It's comfortable inside. It's comfortable on the road. And, you know, it just feels good as you're driving around. - Say except, for the transmission. Because it's the first and second gear on that thing are so short, that when you're leaving from a stop, like leaving out of my driveway, by the time I'm at 15 miles an hour, I'm already in third, and those gear changes are k'thunk. K'thunk. Yeah, it's a minor complaint about an 800 horsepower Challenger. You know, the transmission is built in a way to make that work. But the Mustang shows that you don't need that kind of harsh shift for that kind of power. - Right. Like I actually think it's cool how hard and firm the shifts are in the Redeye. Like it's like this car's built for the power. But then you get in the Ford, and it's like, yeah, this car's built for the power too, and it just doesn't have any of that. - It's really nice. When it came to the timed laps though, that's what I think really surprised us all. Yeah, I was driving. I tend to have a preference for the Camaro. I ran all the cars as hard as I felt like I could. And the results were surprising. I honestly expected the Mustang to win. And it didn't. And we should let you know that off camera, we ran the Mustang again, and got a similar result to what we got first time, and it was still slower than the Camaro got with the bad launch. KURT: Yeah. HOST: And I think if you were on a track that had longer straights, the Mustang would pull an advantage, but it definitely shows the advantage of the Camaro's tires. KURT: Yeah. And I think just the overall purpose of that car is a hot lap. And yeah, I think, on a track, over a whole afternoon, the Camaro would probably hold up a little bit better and probably even be more consistent. - It certainly would have more fuel at the end. - I began to think that the Shelby had a hole in the fuel tank. It rips through gas. Just rips through it. We got to highlight the Challenger, though. The Challenger is a blast. So fun. It's amazing fun. On the road course, yeah, it's slow. But I was laughing harder driving that car than the other two cars, because you would come out of a corner, you'd start a little drift, but you'd keep accelerating forward so you just, OK, maintain the drift, and the transmission would just keep up shifting as your power sliding. I was laughing while doing it. It was so much fun. To be-- yeah, it was just ridiculous. And, again, that shows the strength of the Challenger is more the personality. It's how much fun that car has. - Yeah. I mean, you know, I don't like losing, still. But I had more fun losing in that car than I've had winning in some others, so, I mean, it is a blast. - The conclusion of both videos is, the Mustang wins. It wins the drag race, and it wins the comparison, and pretty handily so. That said, What's your favorite takeaway, Kurt? KURT: Just how good the GT500 is. Of these three cars I would genuinely use my own money to buy it. In reality, I'd just go buy a GT 350. - Ilana? - I mean I sort of sound like a nursery school teacher here, but I feel like there were no losers in this comparison. No matter which one of these three cars is sort of your pony of choice, they're so good. They're so amazing. The technology is incredible that allows you to have a car that you could use as a daily driver and then go run drag-racing numbers that would have literally been race car numbers in the '60s. That, you know, somebody would have been a professional race car driver or a factory racer get those kind of drag strip numbers. So, good job everybody. - That's not to say that like everybody gets a participation award. - I am saying that, actually. - Well, I mean there's no losers here. But there's definitely a winner, and it's the GT 500. Right? But it should win, right? - Oh. Yeah. I mean it basically had the time to look at everybody else's homework, copy it, make edits, and then turn in it's own, so, yeah. - My takeaway is that I agree with Kurt. I'd probably get a GT 350, because it's 8000 RPM in a six-speed manual, and way better fuel economy. - Way better. - Way better fuel economy. So on that bombshell, thank you guys for watching. If you like this particular video, let us know. If you don't, I guess, let us know, too. You're going to do that anyway. Make sure to subscribe, and visit edmunds.com to find your next perfect car. Thanks for watching. Now let's learn about muscle cars. Oh, I've already memorized those.

In this video, Carlos Lago, Elana Scherr and Kurt Niebuhr answer the most common questions about our muscle car drag race and comparison videos. Questions like, "Why didn't you use the Demon?" and "Why didn't you run on a prepared surface?" and "Why did a two-seat Mustang win a utility award?" and "Why are you all so bad at driving?"

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