Locate an Auto Repair Shop in Sutton, Vermont

Sutton, VT Car Consumer Discussions

Re: blast from the past [steve_]

by gagrice on Fri Nov 14 12:54:30 PST 2008

You know my 1999 Suburban was built in April or May of 1998 just before they went of strike. Bought it from Sutton Motors in Hailey ID. I loved that Suburban. I kick myself for selling it and buying the 2005 GMC hybrid PU. Never got that much better mileage. So I got the last of the good GM vehicles. I think it is time to put the General to rest. They will continue to screw up and put out product that is substandard and lose what little market share they still have. Unless they got a big stash of cash in China or Geneva they can tap into. Just say no to mediocrity. We will survive without GM. We made it without Packard that was 10 times the car anything GM ever built to compete.

Re: hmmmmm. [anythngbutgm]

by yak33 on Wed Nov 12 11:21:41 PST 2008

hmmmmm - I'm sure my views will contrast greatly with mr. sutton, and the link you provided means I'll bite my lip and move on. It has presumbably saved me time. All I will say is I've been a ford and gm guy for a long, long time, as was my father. However, life doesn't exist in a vacuum and the changes, both good and bad, in the auto industry over the past many years has been significant. If you can't recognize, acknowledge, and accept them, and are blinded by bias, I can offer nothing to mr. sutton. yak33

Re: Welcome back! [imidazol97]

by mackabee on Tue Jul 15 10:55:02 PDT 2008

"Can you explain further on that event? " I was a young tender lad of 23. My wife and I and little Mackabee jr. needed a car bad. We had an AMC Rambler which we used to call "El poderosito" which means the "Small powerful". I bought the Rambler in Las Cruces New Mexico and drove it to Millington Tn. where I was going to a Navy school. The car was ok but had some issues. On the way to TN. I pulled over in Texas in the middle of nowhere to take a pee. I couldn't hold it until the next town. As I get out of the car I almost fell as the ground was wet and very slippery. As I got back in the car I realized we were stuck! I tried and tried to get the car out of the mud but to no avail. A passing motorist must have called the tow truck or they towed a lot of cars there as one came over in a few minutes. "It's going to cost you $50.00 bucks to get you out of the mud." the tow truck driver said. "$50.00 bucks!!" I exclaimed. You got to remember this was in 1980 and I was just a poor second class petty officer then. So I paid him the 50 and he pulled us out of the mud. We continued our trip. We made it to Tennessee without a problem. Later in the year the starter became loose and one of the bolts that held it together fell off. I remember one winter morning having to put the starter back on as it was almost off the car. After I got done with training we drove back to California and the car made it all the way without a hitch!! Once in San Diego we decided to look for a new car. I had read somewhere that Japanese cars were the best made at that time and we headed out to look at a few. We looked at Nissan, back then it was still called Datsun, Toyota, and Honda. Although Hondas you could only see them in brochures as the dealers had none in stock every one of them was pre-sold. That would have been the time to be selling Honda. So we looked at a couple of domestics also. I was not too familiar with the Japanese brands and they looked rather small to me. We almost bought a Buick Regal and to this day I still don't know why we didn't since it was big and roomy and very nice. I think the sales person was not very enthusiastic and actually was kind of desperate IIRC to sell the car. They discounted it quite a good amount and I thought there must be something wrong with the car if they are trying to unload it so easy. So we left. We went to a Toyota dealer and test drove a pick up truck or as they were called back then a "mini truck". Mrs. Mackabee thought I was crazy for wanting a mini truck and started talking some sense into me. "What are we going to do when we have another kid?" she asked me. "You're right." I replied. Back then I didn't like many of their offerings as they were rather ugly looking. I did like the Celica as it was a bit sporty looking and I'd seen a few on the road. "Let's try a Celica then." I told her. So we get into a Celica ST. No a/c, roll up windows, manual locks, and am/fm radio. What we call in the biz, a "strippy". Me being an ignorant small town boy from New Mexico didn't know you could negotiate the price of the car and to save some money I skipped the GT which was very well equipped but a couple of thousand more. The ST was $7245.00 MSRP. I remember them "giving" us $200.00 for El poderosito which is what I owed on it. So it was a wash. They kept working us on payment the whole time. I remember the salesperson coming back and asking for more money. "Can you do $200.00 or $210.00?" he would ask and my wife would tug at my shirt if I said we could. It was our first new car purchase and by the time it was all said and done we walked out of there with a new car at full pop, 19.90% interest for 48 months thru Ford Motor Credit, and I don't even remember what the payment was. I did refinance the loan with our credit union a couple of months later for quite a lower interest rate. A few years later around Christmas time I went to the local Target store and there was a bin with lots of books under $5 dollars. Since I like to read I perused the inventory and found a gem of a book which I wish I still had. It was Remar Sutton's "Don't get taken, the insider's guide to buying your next car". I leafed through it and found it interesting so I bought it. It was the best $1 buck I have ever spent in my life! I went home and started reading it and didn't stop until I finished it around 3am in the morning. I dug up my old buyer's order and looked the figures over and man was I pissed! I could have paid 1k less and gotten a lower interest rate through my credit union had I done a little homework. That book is also the one that introduced me to Edmund's price guides which used to be sold at any book store, convenience store, and you could find them in the library too. So having learned my lesson the next purchase was 180 degrees the opposite of this one. But that's for another story another day. Mack :shades:

Re: My Customer Misled Me [dino001]

by mackabee on Sun Nov 04 14:54:42 PST 2007

People just want to be treated with dignity and respect. That's it. It's not rocket science. A friend of mine at a competitor dealer put it this way. "Selling cars is easy. All you have to do is say "Yes sir, yes maa'm." Smile and listen to what they tell you. Sure we still get the customers that were hammered by the last salesperson they bought their car from so naturally they have their guard up. And who can blame them? Heck, I remember when I bought my first new Toyota. 1981 Celica ST handshaker, am/fm radio, no cassette, no ac. $7229.00 MSRP. Price paid: $7229.00 MSRP. Trade in $200.00 for an old pos that I would have to get under every once in a while to re-attach the started since the bolt was stripped. Try doing that at 5am in the morning to go to your place of duty while in the Nav. So anyway, I got my car at 21% interest. No previous credit, FOMOCO actually did the financing since they had a Ford store also with my Toyota dealer. Three months later I refinanced through my credit union at a lower 12% which back then was pretty good. That following xmas I walked into a Target store in San Diego Ca right across from the Sports Arena. There was a bin with overstocked books and I just happened to pick up Remar Sutton's "Never get taken again, The insider's guide to buying your next new or used car." Best DOLLAR I've ever spent!! I got home and read the book cover to cover. It has a story line and a carachter which later one of my managers named me. (Killer Monsoon). I looked at my documents and looked at the info on the book and came to the conclusion I was clubbed like a baby seal and more! That was the only time it happened. And you know in a way I'm glad it did because I got an education and learned my lesson well. From then on every single car that I've bought I've negotiated a fair deal for me and the salesperson. Even private transactions have gone rather well. If you get a chance pick up the book and you can see how the inside of the dealership works. It's now in it's revised edition with internet and stuff but if you can get your hands on the original it's well worth a read.\ \ Mackabee

Re: Not Applicable [docrw]

by lemmer on Thu Apr 03 13:08:42 PDT 2008

Funny you should mention this... The general managers were given a choice. They could have either of two pitchers, and they could make their selection knowing what the pitchers would do in their careers. One pitcher would pitch for 12 years, having a poor-to-mediocre first six years, then a spectacularly good last six years. The other would pitch for 23 years and win 324 games. The general managers were asked to choose either Sandy Koufax or Don Sutton. Eight selected Koufax, six chose Sutton and two said they could not decide. My experience is that it is difficult to get people to agree on anything.

Re: Not Applicable [habitat1]

by docrw on Thu Apr 03 12:52:43 PDT 2008

I agree with you 100% on success being a factor of hard work and talent rather than luck a vast majority of the time. Often what some see as luck is really the result of hard work, or the talent to see what others couldn't, that put you in the right position at the right time. The guy who wasn't there wasn't unlucky he just didn't put in the work, or didn't have the talent, to make it to that point. However, I'm afraid I don't see the relevance of the rest of your post with respect to this conversation about the GT-R. Are we judging the quality of the car on the market today or the intentions of Nissan's executives 10 years from now? Whether or not the GT-R will still be a great car 50 years from now is not remotely salient to its comparison to the 911. The question is, is the GT-R as good, or better, than the 911 right now? Or, to put it another way, if you were in the market today which would you buy? I don't think anyone really believes that the GT-R, as compelling a car as it is, will drive Porsche out of business. Furthermore, judging the talent of an artist based on longevity is not an indication of talent but rather stamina or passion. By your standards Don Sutton would be considered a better pitcher than Sandy Koufax because he pitched for 23 years vs 12. Would any rational person make that argument though? Is John Williams a better composer than Mozart? He's been composing for a much longer time than Mozart did. Talent/quality is one measure, while sustained passion/stamina is a different measure. Its like comparing a flashlight that will last for 10 years but at 1/5 the intensity of one that will last for one year. If you are buying one to take on a camping trip your choice would be different than if you were buying one to keep in your kitchen in case the power goes out.