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Jamaica, NY Car Consumer Discussions

Re: i hope somebody here can help me [yising]

by vois22 on Sun Oct 12 22:02:41 PDT 2008

Ok, so it gets to this: Purchase Price 17407.00 Dealer will pay TTL , 1429.00 Doc free 150.00 Sub-Total 18986.00 The $8000 down is consumer's choice, but I wouldn't recommend it if she is sure she wants this Toyota and that she wants to keep it for all of 36 months. This thing will be under bumper-to-bumper warranty for 36 months. Toyota's hold their value so well, $8000 is an AWFUL lot of cash to put down on a new Toyota car which is only worth $16500-$17500. Heck, she could pay the TTL of 1429.00 herself at her local motor vehicle bureau office ... and finance only $13,057 (worksheet below) at 1.9% for 48 months, and she would have an extra $2,071 in her pocket right now (not to mention an extra $22.30 PER MONTH in her pocket after that compared to a $305 monthly payment) ... and she could invest that extra immediate $2,071 elsewhere for a better outcome (or go to Jamaica on vacation, etc). Here's that worksheet: (With this worksheet below, she will go to the DMV to pay her own taxes and license fee.) purchase price 17,407 doc fee 150 (minus downpay and deposit) ( -4,500) AMOUNT FINANCED: 13057 1.90% at 48 months ==> $282.70 per month -or- 0.00% at 36 months ==> $362.69 per month Please note she would be investing only $4,500 into the car upfront, instead of $8500. Under this $4500 scenario, let's assume she decides in 44 (fourty-four) months to trade-in her Corolla and get a new car. At that point, after 44 months, she would still owe only $1,130 on her loan on that car ... but the trade-in value were she to trade it in will be SEVEN THOUSAND DOLLARS at that 44 month point. (assuming the car is in good shape, no wrecks on title history, runs well and needs only a little reconditioning to be sold at retail). And, here is what she can do with the extra $2,071 in-hand right now: - Give it to her boyfriend. - Invest it into a 36-month CD for savings at a 3.25% interest rate --- then at 36 months withdraw that CD which will have grown to $2300.00 by that time. She can then use that $2300 towards yet a larger down payment on her next car to "move up" to the next gen vehicle such as hybrids or Camry etc. - Or, just blow it now on a vacation or new toy. Help the U.S. economy. And, here is what she can do with the extra $22.30 per month during those 44 months: - Send me beer money. - Save it into a small savings account for 44 months. Those monthly deposits of $22.30 will grow to just under $1,000 by 44 months. - A $22.30 monthly meal or night out with her boyfriend, each month. Hope that helps. Since you are doing the low financing, we can say that, yes your purchase price is about $800 too high, but that seems to be the only hit you are taking here. Go in and say, we change our minds, unless we can get another $800 off the purchase price. Negotiate in the middle -- take it from $17,407 to $17,000 even.

Re: I am obviously not here... [ocim]

by mrtrace1 on Wed Sep 17 09:56:09 PDT 2008

Keep convincing yourself that the TL is a luxury car that's not in the same league with Maximas, Avalons, ES350s, Passats, Saabs and other premium FWD/entry-lux vehicles. Perhaps you're now seeing a correlation between the cars just mentioned, their all front wheel drive, $30k-$35k cars, some with premium badges some without. Have you noticed that Infiniti's G35, BMW's 3 series and Mercedes C-class are more nimble RWD vehicles that in order to be had at the TL's price point are basically stripped down? Instead of being a badge whore call an ace an ace and a spade a spade. Even Acura has acknowledged that they are not Tier 1 level and have some work to do so before they are even considered to be. Since we're talking aces and spades, correct me if I'm wrong but isn't the TL on the Accord's chasis (I know the Acura has more luxury packed features, a bigger engine and more features -- but it's heritage is an Accord, period)? So how in the heck does that translate into a G-35/3 series/C-class competitor? Simple it doesn't. You can dispute it all you want, but opinions are simply that. Facts are facts - bring them.

Re: I am obviously not here... [praz]

by mrtrace1 on Thu Sep 18 13:09:57 PDT 2008

Marvelous post sir. You said all I wanted to say in 1 post (I believe I said half of that in about 10, lol). In any case, I had no idea the ES350 is going rwd the next time around. Looks like Infiniti was the first to take the lead and offer an exclusively rwd format (the awd is still based off a rwd platform) and now Acura and Lexus are following. Realistically, going in the future (in say 3 or 4 years) do you guys think the Japanese are going to still be able to offer $35k front wheel drive cars (these $35k cars were only $30k a few years ago and are getting more expensive year by year) and stay competive while Detroit is going back to rwd based cars and/or while charging the same price as the Europeans/Infiniti (perhaps Infiniti knew this years ago)? Giving credit to Lexus, their cars are for the most part rwd based. What I find interesting though is that while Lexus is majority rwd based they have less of a sporting reputation than the fwd based Acura vehicles. While I love the TL I have to reasonably ask myself whether the fwd car is a better buy than the awd car, guess I'd have to drive both back to back to find out.

Re: I am obviously not here... [darkguy]

by mrtrace1 on Thu Sep 18 09:02:55 PDT 2008

No drug usage here at all. Nissan actually doesn't sell that many cloth equipped base model Maximas and never has. A fully equipped Maxima which is in the price range of a TL has as many bells and whistles, if not more. Not kidding, just simply stating facts, which are actually undisputable. In any case, if you had read the various posts (and not just my last one) you would see that we are disputing that the Maxima is not in the Accord's territory at all, but moreso the TL's territory, which ocim seems to think the Accord is a better vehicle than the Maxima. If anyone is on drugs, and I highly suspect a very good substance at that, it's mr. ocim.

Re: I am obviously not here... [ocim]

by mrtrace1 on Thu Sep 18 05:54:06 PDT 2008

Ocim in further reply to your post I will break this post down apples to apples. Since you're a very educated person (you said I need to go back to school) I am sure you will follow along with this very simple post. Since the official 2009 TL is not on sale today I would be buying a 2008 TL so we will take a look at the 2008 Maxima (more on this later in the post). I mention this car and not the other premium/entry-level luxury vehicles because you have not said anything negative about them. Since I've driven the 2007 Maxima (basically the same as a 2008 Maxima) many many times I can fairly comment on why the Maxima is on par with and perhaps even better than the Accord you say is does not measure up to. When was the last time you hopped in any Accord and was greeted to a Bluetooth package, back-up sensors, birds-eye navigation (Nissan actually wins hands-down on this component - not on the navi as a whole), a smart key system, power tilt and telescopic steering wheel, power fold-away mirrors and other luxury features. My question to you is when was the last time you drove an Accord of Maxima back to back since you have stated you've driven both? Have you driven in a recent Maxima since Nissan decided to take it upscale and have the Altima compete toe to toe with the Accord? In any case, go get me an Accord with all of those features and bring it back to me. Actually go get me a 2008 TL and bring it back to with all of those features. We're not even talking 2009 models yet. As much as I love the new TL it still does not offer some of the features the 2009 Maxima does, but I can live with that as I love the new TL's styling over the Maxima.

Re: I am obviously not here... [praz]

by mrtrace1 on Thu Sep 18 05:33:29 PDT 2008

Praz, you hit it on the nose. The TL does not compete with those RWD cars. Our other poster believes that the TL is in the 3 series/c class/g 35 territory, when in fact it is not. Does that mean some folks aren't cross shopping them? No, but I am sure a true enthusiast would not even consider a FWD car, and that includes the TL. Until the TL loses its Accord heritage (FWD) it will simply have the limitations that all FWD cars have, no matter how they well they refine it. For myself, I'm not stuck on the whole FWD/RWD format issue as I am after the luxury moreso than the sporty ride. Notice that the base TL has less than 300 hp? I think this is because it's front wheel drive and putting more power to the front wheels would have been unsensible. Notice that the AWD model that has the 300+ ponies as I believe Acura believed only the AWD model could handle it and handle it well.